# Disputation Between Jacob De Keersgieter And Mr. Friar Cornelis, A Franciscan Monk; In The Presence Of Mr. Jan Van Damme, Recorder, And Mr. Michiel Houwaert, Clerk Of The Criminal Court, On The 9th Of May, A. D. 1569.306 · Page 5 of 13 [Previous page: DISPUTATION BETWEEN JACOB DE KEERSGIETER AND MR. FRIAR CORNELIS, A FRANCISCAN MONK; IN THE PRESENCE OF MR. JAN VAN DAMME, RECORDER, AND MR. MICHIEL HOUWAERT, CLERK OF THE CRIMINAL COURT, ON THE 9TH OF MAY, A. D. 1569.306](/en/stories/mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec/part-4/) · [Book contents](/en/sources/martyrs-mirror/#book-contents) · [Next page: DISPUTATION BETWEEN JACOB DE KEERSGIETER AND MR. FRIAR CORNELIS, A FRANCISCAN MONK; IN THE PRESENCE OF MR. JAN VAN DAMME, RECORDER, AND MR. MICHIEL HOUWAERT, CLERK OF THE CRIMINAL COURT, ON THE 9TH OF MAY, A. D. 1569.306](/en/stories/mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec/part-6/) Fr. Corn. Is it possible, so outspoken? you accursed Anabaptist, though you do not believe it, the sacrament of confirmation is therefore not one whit worse, for we Catholics believe it so much the more. My lords, what do you say of this accursed Anabaptist? for he does not believe in anything, that he don’t. Recorder. Suffer yourself to be instructed, Jacob, and believe that which a Christian ought to believe, and don’t argue so much. Jac. My lords, with your permission, I only answer to all his questions, and I believe only that which is written in the holy Scriptures. Fr. Corn. Do you? * * * for you do not believe, that St. Paul, in the beginning of the fourth chapter of his first epistle to the Corinthians, writes: I will that every one so account of us, as of priests of Christ over the sacraments of God. And as I said, St. James writes the same, in his fifth chapter: Is any sick, call for the priests of the church; and let them pray over him, and anoint him with oil in the name of the Lord. Are we priests then not dispensers or administrators of God’s sacraments? and you say now, that you believe in all that is written in the holy Scriptures. It remains now to be seen or heard, what you believe concerning the sacrament of holy unction, of which St. James writes, as I tell you. Let us hear once. Jac. I do not believe that the anointing with oil of which James writes has anything in common with the oil with which you anoint the sick among you; for the oil of which James writes healed the sick, as did also the oil concerning which Mark writes in the sixth chapter, that the apostles anointed with oil many that were sick, and healed them. But however much you priests adjure and conjure your oil, it can nevertheless not heal the sick; hence, that was another oil, than your oil which you call a sacrament. Fr. Corn. A thousand devils (God bless us) what ails this hellish heretic now, that he makes sorcery of our reading, consecrating, blessing, and sanctifying over the sacrament of extreme unction. You bewitched, bedeviled, possessed Anabaptist, have reproved me once, because I cursed and condemned you; but I should go at you quite differently yet, in cursing, condemning and anathematizing you; but you are not worthy that I should so incense and excite myself about you. Therefore I tell you, yes, we Catholics call holy unction a sacrament, and regard it as a sacrament, and it is a sacrament, in spite of your mouth. Do you understand this, you bewitched, accursed Anabaptist, that you are? Jac. If you want to imitate all the things which the apostles did, and regard them all as sacraments, why do you not also regard your aprons or handkerchiefs as sacraments, and lay them upon the sick, as Paul did? For what greater sacredness was there in the oil of which James writes, than in Paul’s aprons, by which he also healed the sick, as is written in the nineteenth chapter of the Acts of the apostles? Fr. Corn. If the devil does not wag your tongue, I do not understand the matter. You accursed Anabaptists may yourselves make a sacrament of your filthy handkerchiefs or aprons; for you people have no sacrament, but we Catholics have seven sacraments; is it not enough, eh? Jac. Yea, in troth; for since the term sacrament is not once mentioned in the holy Scriptures, you have only seven too many. Fr. Corn. Bah, does not St. Paul call marriage a sacrament? And he does not bestow too much honor upon marriage, when he says, in the fifth chapter to the Ephesians: This sacrament is great. Would you reject this honor, put it from you, and trample upon it with your feet, I suppose? Jac. Paul says: Two shall be one flesh; this is a great mystery. Eph. 5:31,32. If you want to make sacraments of all the mysteries, I am surprised that you have only seven sacraments. Fr. Corn. It is easy to hear, that you Anabaptists do not esteem marriage very highly; for, if we priests should say, that priesthood only is a sacrament, and marriage not, I think you would reply: Show us where priesthood is called a sacrament, as is marriage. But when I consider the matter well, you Anabaptists do not observe marriage, since you have the women and maidens in common, and run together promiscuously, like dogs, the father with his daughter, the mother with her son, the brother with his sister, just like the beasts—is this not a fine thing? Jac. With your permission, don’t get incensed, we are slandered in regard to this. ## Original source [Read this passage on Project Gutenberg](https://www.gutenberg.org/cache/epub/65855/pg65855-images.html#Page_745) [Edition details](https://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/65855) [Previous page: DISPUTATION BETWEEN JACOB DE KEERSGIETER AND MR. FRIAR CORNELIS, A FRANCISCAN MONK; IN THE PRESENCE OF MR. JAN VAN DAMME, RECORDER, AND MR. MICHIEL HOUWAERT, CLERK OF THE CRIMINAL COURT, ON THE 9TH OF MAY, A. D. 1569.306](/en/stories/mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec/part-4/) · [Book contents](/en/sources/martyrs-mirror/#book-contents) · [Next page: DISPUTATION BETWEEN JACOB DE KEERSGIETER AND MR. FRIAR CORNELIS, A FRANCISCAN MONK; IN THE PRESENCE OF MR. JAN VAN DAMME, RECORDER, AND MR. MICHIEL HOUWAERT, CLERK OF THE CRIMINAL COURT, ON THE 9TH OF MAY, A. D. 1569.306](/en/stories/mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec/part-6/) --- Page: https://history.truechristian.church/en/stories/mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec/part-5/ [Contribute a correction or addition](https://github.com/trueChristian/history.truechristian.church/issues/new?title=Correction%3A+Disputation+Between+Jacob+De+Keersgieter+And+Mr.+Friar+Cornelis%2C+A+Franciscan+Monk%3B+In+The+Presence+Of+Mr.+Jan+Van+Damme%2C+Recorder%2C+And+Mr.+Michiel+Houwaert%2C+Clerk+Of+The+Criminal+Court%2C+On+The+9th+Of+May%2C+A.+D.+1569.306+%C2%B7+Page+5+of+13&body=%23%23+Page+or+topic%0ADisputation+Between+Jacob+De+Keersgieter+And+Mr.+Friar+Cornelis%2C+A+Franciscan+Monk%3B+In+The+Presence+Of+Mr.+Jan+Van+Damme%2C+Recorder%2C+And+Mr.+Michiel+Houwaert%2C+Clerk+Of+The+Criminal+Court%2C+On+The+9th+Of+May%2C+A.+D.+1569.306+%C2%B7+Page+5+of+13%0A%0APage%3A+https%3A%2F%2Fhistory.truechristian.church%2Fen%2Fstories%2Fmm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec%2Fpart-5%2F%0A%0ARecord%3A+mm-disputation-between-jacob-de-keersgieter-and-mr-friar-cornelis-a-franciscan-monk-in-the-presence-of-mr-jan-van-damme-rec--b00097-o000000%0A%0ADate+currently+shown%3A+1569%0A%0A%23%23+Correction+or+addition%0A%0A%0A%0A%23%23+Sources+and+evidence%0APlease+include+book%2Fpage+references%2C+archive+links%2C+or+first-hand+documentation.%0A%0A%0A%0A%23%23+Image+credit+%28if+applicable%29%0ACreator%2C+source%2C+and+permission+or+public-domain+basis.%0A%0A%0A%0ASubmitted+for+review%3B+this+issue+does+not+publish+changes+automatically.)